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Author Topic: DIY Audio Server using two Intel Xeon CPU's  (Read 699 times)
MarcelNL
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« on: August 31, 2024, 10:01:17 PM »

For a while now I've been investigating what makes a good digital source sing, at BAM! I brought my Mk2 version yet the current system is leaps ahead of that.

Currently I'm building the succesor of my current setup (Ryzen 16 core on Gigabyte Master MB)

Dual Xeon CPU's  on an Asus Sage server Motherboard, ATP server registered ECC RAM, a linear power supply with CLCLC filtering using Hi-B cut chokes made by Martin Mug, active rectifier using GaN Mosfets, Mundorf Ag and HC caps and some NOS PIO bypasses feeding the Taiko Audio ATX module.
Output taken care of by the Pink Faun I2S ultra bridge fed by a clean 5 V, OS stored on a pseudo SLC NVME SSD, network using Solarflare X2522 in low latency mode and so on.

Digital is my main source, the RCA 70 B will be the second since any mono recordings have been digitized poorly, I wonder which of the two sources is going to be the heaviest in weight


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wenig watt
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« Reply #1 on: August 31, 2024, 10:49:20 PM »

Hi Marcel,
nice to read from you! I'd be happy to help out with some lead for the RCA wink. I don't know much about digital and computers, but I was impressed at the BAM! I'm looking forward to our next meeting, wherever it may be. My professional misery can't last forever and we don't live that far apart.
I'm curious to see if one day I'll make the leap into the future again. My first attempt failed with an ITunes update. After that, hundreds of hours of reading CDs were lost. Do you also use modern amplifiers? In summer, I always wish for significantly less waste heat than with my tube technology.


With best regards

Arndt
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MarcelNL
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« Reply #2 on: August 31, 2024, 11:27:09 PM »

Hi Marcel,
nice to read from you! I'd be happy to help out with some lead for the RCA wink. I don't know much about digital and computers, but I was impressed at the BAM! I'm looking forward to our next meeting, wherever it may be. My professional misery can't last forever and we don't live that far apart.
I'm curious to see if one day I'll make the leap into the future again. My first attempt failed with an ITunes update. After that, hundreds of hours of reading CDs were lost. Do you also use modern amplifiers? In summer, I always wish for significantly less waste heat than with my tube technology.


With best regards

Arndt

Hi Arndt,

I'm currently using some flea power tube amps, one tube (PL519 G2 connected as triode) made by Olaf, currently fed by a 16 core Ryzen CPU and powered by a linear PSU. Speakers are some vintage Philips fullrange units awaiting to be replaced by a sort of impression of Bionor....I had a single 'trionor' in our in between houses place, and plan on building two in our current permanent residence (three 13" Tesla fullrange units per channel in a FLH using a large baffle)

we'll meet again, if not at BAM in 2025 we'll make it work!

best
Marcel
« Last Edit: August 31, 2024, 11:55:48 PM by MarcelNL » Logged
MarcelNL
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« Reply #3 on: November 15, 2024, 07:32:03 PM »

The dual Xeon server is up and running, still some issues to sort with the seating of the CPU's ...a crappy design that calls for 12Lb/in torque but only has 4 pins...so crooked seating is built in...

Using a linear PSU with custom chokes and Mundorf High Current and Audio Grade caps, fancy bypass stuff for the 12V going into the MB and all that, UPOCC wiring, a Taiko ATX module, active GaN rectifier, special RDIMM and so on, Pink Faun I2S out into my Adagio Dac with DAC 3 modules.

this purple Elephant is truly good, addictive I might say....it flies past the previous build (AMD  Ryzen 16 core on an extreme overclocker Motherboard)
 
« Last Edit: November 15, 2024, 07:40:34 PM by MarcelNL » Logged
MarcelNL
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« Reply #4 on: November 22, 2024, 07:08:00 PM »

Finally got the kinks ironed out, one of the CPU's was not seated properly and in the process of tightening the bolts one snapped...luckily that was salvageable, I had to bend a few CPU landing pins back in shape, find another fastening system and redo much of the cabling....but IT SINGS even better now the OS is permanently installed.

This really is a LEAP beyond what I was listening to previously, a 16 Core Ryzen on an Extreme MB using the same power supply...this is Digital with a capital D smiling


Setup; 500VA Toroidy Audio Transformer, Saligny Power Active Rectifier V2, Mundorf AG 4 pin and HC Caps, custom Martin Mug chokes, Taiko ATX, Neotech UPOCC wiring, Asus C621 E Sage MB, dual Xeon 4210, 12 ATP RDIMMs, Asus Hyper PCIE to NMVE, Samsung 990 pro*2, Pink Faun I2S Ultra OXCO, Solarflare X2522 PLus.

To do:
put bypasses on all power to the MB
install the Femto clock NVME SSD for the OS   

yes that is quite a layout, but hey, look at what Analog needs to truly perform

« Last Edit: November 22, 2024, 07:14:36 PM by MarcelNL » Logged
wenig watt
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« Reply #5 on: November 22, 2024, 08:43:59 PM »

Hello Marcel
I really don't understand much about your machine. Unfortunately, this has largely passed me by. I had an early accident with computers and audio in which about 200 albums were lost in nirvana. ‘Dumbest Assumed User’ or “DAU” for short.
But what we heard in Berlin was very impressive, and if it's really better now, it must be pretty damn close to reality... I'm curious

Best regards

Arndt
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MarcelNL
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« Reply #6 on: November 22, 2024, 08:59:39 PM »

Hello Marcel
I really don't understand much about your machine. Unfortunately, this has largely passed me by. I had an early accident with computers and audio in which about 200 albums were lost in nirvana. ‘Dumbest Assumed User’ or “DAU” for short.
But what we heard in Berlin was very impressive, and if it's really better now, it must be pretty damn close to reality... I'm curious

Best regards

Arndt


Hi Arndt,

its ridiculous how good digital can be, this iteration is miles ahead of what you heard with an 8 core CPU on a simple motherboard and a switching power supply.

I'll bring the beast to BAM, just need some help carrying it in

best
Marcel
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wenig watt
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« Reply #7 on: November 22, 2024, 09:09:49 PM »

Hello Marcel,
surely you know that nothing can be as good as an analogue record on a Lenco, unless you call your machine "The Big Ocnel".
I'll help you carry it! :laugh
I look forward to seeing you again.

Best regards

Arndt
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MarcelNL
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« Reply #8 on: November 22, 2024, 09:42:37 PM »

Thanks for the offer Arndt!

There also will be some paraphernalia, like a dac, amps (as I'm using balanced out and these amps were designed for my setup by Olaf) and some external PSU's.


Perhaps by that time an external In out Module as well...we'll see....

I'll pay my respect to the almighty Lenco entering the building;-)
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MarcelNL
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« Reply #9 on: November 23, 2024, 11:40:26 AM »

Sure!

I started out many years ago wondering how a ripped CD would compare to my modified CD player (TDA 1547 gold crown without OS, TX2575 I/V resistor, SRPP E80C tube stage etc), so I started using a laptop and a Teradak based on the 1547 that I (again) modded the heck out, and never played another CD.

Then I wondered if a dedicated computer with a decent power supply would improve sound, so I got an intel NUC (dual core celeron) and a lineair 19V PSU...that kicked off all of this as tinkering with yet another power supply for the SSD hard drive was another huge improvement.

A 'few' experiments and years later I started the recent development path....with an AMD 6 core CPU on a budget MB using a standard computer SMPS, and was impressed...but got curious about the why (story of my life). So I got a better and more powerful 1200W SMPS, a CPU with 8 cores, a Pink Faun I2S output PCIe card on a linear PSU, and implemented passive cooling (funny enough is vibration a big lust killer in digital), which was the setup at BAM!

That led to some iterations with ever increasing core count, and the notion that more is better, different types of RAM sound different, more power is better...so I built a linear unregulated PSU around the time Taiko Audio released a DIY ATX module based on GaN mosfets.

(Taiko develops digital music servers, and I tend to think they are the cutting edge for music servers.)

I bought their ATX, started playing with active recifiers, got custom made chokes in Hi-b cut core by Martin Mug as there is a clear relation between instant power delivery and quality of sound, tinkered with 8 core , 12 core and then 16 core AMD CPU's and numerous wires and bypass caps.
Ever increasing detail, power, presentation, basically sound got better and better and more natural and dynamic...

in parallel there was a group of similar fools doing similar things in computer audio fora, and  they veered off into a dual Xeon build, sort of a poor mans Taiko Extreme..

At some point a 16 core CPU was about the max I could get, the next level was server CPUs like the new AMD threadripper, and Intel Xeon....and knowing Taiko did audition about any relevant MB (and had one custom built) and CPU there is when they created the Extreme I took the jump and started the current build based on belief they know what they are doing planning this to be the über build

Long story short, more computing power means better detail retrieval (so it IS there in that digital, even when streaming), vastly better dynamics and weight, top end becomes sweet, leading edge trainling edge AND texture of sound in the middle.

Something similar goes for power supply....it needs to be capable of delivering power in femtoseconds...a CPU is fed by 12V to the MB where it is turned into approx 1Volt that goes direct to the CPU pins..the faster that 1V can deliver current the better stuff sounds.. so that is likely why MB with more power phases do better for audio.

SSD is another thing...there is a difference in what SSD data is stored on, with Intel Optane and pseudo SLC being best IMHO, heck even what the operating system is stored on makes a difference in sound, what OS matters for sound too. Same with RAM.

Current setup (work in progress):

Audio router and switch on 2 linear PSUs with active rectifying, Lundahl chokes, loads of mundorf 4 pin AG caps and Sean Jacobs DC3.
Dual Xeon 4210 on Asus Sage C621 and 12x4 Gb ATP RDIMM running Daphile (Arch Linux distro with LMS integrated)
Solarflare X2522 plus (ultra low latency) fiberoptic network input, finisar 1475 BTL SFPs using corning glass fiber with grade A connectors and
Pink Faun I2S bridge with Ultra OCXO
Active rectifier using GaN, Mug Hib cut core chokes, Mundorf AC and HC caps, numerous fancy bypass caps
All in a pertinax box

playing into my Metrum Adagio DAC 3

basically the game is to have the CPU's do as little as possible, a CPU is as apparently inherently as lazy as we humans using them....CPU 1 handles a couple of tasks, CPU 2 some others....just pushing bytes from the stream or the NVME SSD with music files takes nothing (O and do play from memory and store as redbook WAV, not FLAC, no high res unless that is a native high res recording etc),...no upsampling, no filtering, no room correction....CPU load as low as possible, any functions that are not required shut down in BIOS, it is all clearly audible.

Bottom line is, a rapberry Pi can do the same thing, but this sounds so much better.
« Last Edit: November 23, 2024, 11:51:20 AM by MarcelNL » Logged
hatehifi
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« Reply #10 on: November 23, 2024, 04:11:25 PM »

Hello Marcel
I really don't understand much about your machine. Unfortunately, this has largely passed me by. I had an early accident with computers and audio in which about 200 albums were lost in nirvana. ‘Dumbest Assumed User’ or “DAU” for short.
But what we heard in Berlin was very impressive, and if it's really better now, it must be pretty damn close to reality... I'm curious

Best regards

Arndt


Yes, the best digital I have heard. Kudos that it is niw even better!

Cheers!
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John
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stratokaster83
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« Reply #11 on: November 23, 2024, 05:09:28 PM »

 
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MarcelNL
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« Reply #12 on: November 23, 2024, 06:33:29 PM »

Yes, the best digital I have heard. Kudos that it is niw even better!

Cheers!

thanks for the compliment, that was just the outline of what can be done with digital I assure you

By now I think it can give R2R a run for its money...we'll see, soon..
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MarcelNL
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« Reply #13 on: November 24, 2024, 10:49:47 AM »

No problem, just know that the much repeated theory of 'it's all 0's and 1's' is just that, a theory.....all zeroes and ones are equal, but some are more equal than others 

Swapping one CPU for another, or using 14AWG UPOCC is pretty technical IMHO, but I get your drift.
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« Reply #14 on: November 24, 2024, 11:45:17 AM »

Marcel,

thanks for your reply. Unfortunately we are talking past each other. I was not asking for aspects of psychoacoustics in your evaluation but about the technical changes and their match to effects on sound. Sorry, no offense, but with what I have read, my interest has dropped to below zero.

Luckily in computer technology all important processes are ruled and managed by protocols. So we are always dealing with a 1:1 transfer of data and if a packet is not transferred correct, the protocol always requests it again. In addition, it is a purely digital data stream up until after the D/A converter. The audio file is packed in this data stream. The data stream only becomes a sequence of tones after the conversion from digital to analogue that can be influenced or manipulated in some way. All this is up to the analogue output stage in your DAC.




There is an upside though - spending money on Mundorf coils and PIO capacitors for a router PSU is good for the economy  wink
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